Fun in Public (Discuss)
I was thinking about something and I wanted to get everyone’s thoughts. From time to time I have seen stories posted on here where the couple was in public and they had a sexual encounter of some kind. I’m sure many of us have experienced something like this. I’ve even posted a few stories like this myself. These range anywhere from in a park at night, to a dressing room in a clothing store, to in a car parked somewhere, in a car while driving, a movie theater and various other public or semi public places. I’ve even seen some stories of people masturbating in their car in a parking lot!
Here’s my dilemma: In Romans 13:1-5 Paul says we are to submit to the governing authorities. He says the authorities that exist have been established by God so rebelling against them is akin to rebelling against God. Then he says, “You must obey the government for two reasons: to keep from being punished and to keep a clear conscience.” (Rom 13:5, NLT)
Now the laws in every state (to my knowledge anyway) state that nudity and sexual activity in public is illegal. This is the case whether you are married or not. And anyone caught in any act of public nudity or sexual activity can be arrested and/or fined.
So my question is: Should we, as Christians, refrain from engaging in any kind of sexual play in any public or semi public area based on Romans 13? (I’m not asking if you WOULD, but rather, if we SHOULD.)
Or do we have certain freedoms and sometimes part of the thrill is to a) act in the moment regardless where you are and b) try to hurry before you do get seen or caught. So as long as we are responsible to make sure we don’t get seen or caught then don’t worry about it? But, what of Romans 13 that says to submit to the “laws of the land?”
My wife and I have gone back and forth on this many times. She grew up with several family members in law enforcement. So she is very conscientious of the law. I have tried to expand our horizons and experience the thrill of having sex in a park or a dressing room, etc. just to give it that little extra spark. There is a certain thrill with having sex in a dressing room knowing there are people walking around just on the other side of the door. It’s the same thrill as being outside in a park at night. But should we do this?
I wanted to get the thoughts of everyone on Marriage Heat.
So what do you guys think? Should we do sexual things with our spouse in public or semi public places? Or should we “obey the laws of the land” and refrain based on Romans 13?
Open discussion time. I’d really like to hear some thoughts on this.
Here’s my quick thoughts on it. First off it is a sin for us to see someone of the opposite sex naked, except our own spouses. (This is why I think it is also important that a persons doctor should be the same sex too.) So if you are having sex out in public, and someone happens to come upon you (and just think if it is a child….), and/or sees a breast, or penis or such, then you have sinned and that makes it wrong and therefore you shouldn’t be doing it.
Same thing as mentioned above about local laws. We are supposed to obey the local laws. If there is a law about public indecency/sex in public, then breaking that law is sinning and therefore wrong and we shouldn’t do it.
We can try to justify it all we want, but in the end we will have to answer to God. And for me, avoiding something that can be easily avoided, just ensures my list doesn’t grow too big for the end.
I disagree that it is a sin to simply see someone of the opposite sex naked. I think this thought process has caused too many to feel shame and guilt when it is unneeded. I do agree that we should strive to obey our local laws and keep sex discreet if we choose to engage in it in a more public place so as to to protect children from indecent exposure and protect ourselves from jail time or fines. An idea we’ve utilized would be for the woman to wear a long skirt without underwear (perfect cowgirl position cover-up) so that if you are “caught” in a public place like a park or forest preserve, you’re not completely exposed and can discreetly cover up. With this type of cover used correctly you could just as likely be making out with clothes on than having sex.
I agree completely with you, Blondie.
Here’s a quick thought. Agree with Blondie, and there is SO MUCH we CAN do in public. Commando, cleavage, body-emphasizing clothes, whispered hot comments, brief touches, stolen moments of HOT passion, all leading to all-out rip-roaring passion later. It’s good to know about the faith-filled limits, and avoid them. But, running far from them so that married, public erotic play becomes tepid and, quite frankly, boring, does not nurture the fire we can have with our spouse. More later; Queen is coming home from shopping, and I am waiting for her, if you catch my meaning. Nurture your fire, peeps!
Brother, thank you for asking about this. It is a pleasure to be sharpened by iron, and I offer my comments with similar honour and intent.
This question comes down the issue of ‘What is the whole duty of man?’. That is simple–to love God and obey his commands. As Christians what are His commands? Well, we are under grace not the the law, and we have one command, which is to love others as Christ loves us. This yoke / burden is light because Christ gives us the strength to do all good things, which has prepared in advance for us to do; and the Holy Spirit wills us and gives us the grace to do. Now since we know that all things are permissible, bot not everything is beneficial, and there is a time and a season for all things under the sun, and that we are exhorted to be not righteous over much; neither make thyself over wise lest we destroy ourselves, nor over much wicked nor foolish; and we should not use our freedom as a cloak of maliciousness, then to to me it is therefore ok, yet within the guidance outlined above. It is not like this is going to occur on the corner of First & Main in the middle of downtown–in the posts I have read, there always seemed to be an element of discretion. However, at the end of the day it will be the people themselves who need to give an account of their own actions to Him, not you, yet by asking this question you have fulfilled your obligation as your brothers keeper. And, again I am thankful for both your goading to ponder upon it and the opportunity to reply.
Graceful blessings to you,
I do not agree that it is a sin to see someone of the opposite sex naked. I do believe that in marriage it is a sin to lust for that person if he or she is not your spouse. Ben accidently walked in on my dear friend Cynthia in our pool house while she was changing out of her swim suit and saw her bare assed. We all laughed about it.
I believe that we should try to obey laws however if we do have sex in a public place Don’t get naked and make sure no kids are around have clothes on that are longer and not tight I believe that god intended for us to have sex where we please (in means of course) it’s not breaking the law unless its exposing something or doing the actual deed I would also take my chances on it being night rather daylight
I also disagree that it is a sin to simply see someone naked. Context and motive would play a role there. If you were trying to sneak a peak at someone naked then it would be a sin. And I also don’t agree that we need to have same sex doctors. My wife has a male gyno and it’s never been a problem. Medical nudity is very different from sexual nudity. And besides, what about artwork and paintings of nude people, especially women? How would that be a sin to go to an art gallery and see some very famous works of nudity? Art is different from porn just like medical nudity is different from sexual nudity. So nudity in and of itself isn’t “sin.” Jesus said sinful thoughts aren’t external anyway but come from the heart. So like I said it’s about your motive and the context. If you accidentally walk in on someone changing (like GG’s hubby did) that’s not sin. But if he was trying to see her friend naked and he purposely hung out near the pool house while she was in there hoping to catch a glimpse, then that would be sin. But that would be more of a matter of his heart and motives, not just seeing her naked.
That is a great way of describing it, HH!
Great points HH! Ben was more embarrassed and apologetic about the whole incident with Cynthia. We of course picked at him about it, all in good fun.
I meant to include this in my previous statement but had an issue to tend to and needed to get off the internet.
Like you said, sin and lust comes from the heart. Nudity in itself is not a sin. I have a female gyno, but when she is unavailable I sometimes will be seen by her male counterpart. He is always kind and very professional.
Just thought I would throw another 2 cents out there. God bless and stay horny as always!
I agree on one point in particular – i have a female doctor. Why? I prefer comfort, the warmer bedside manner, and it’s easier to open up to a female about issues involving health than a “dude.” Also, I prefer the more tender touch of a female given many of my issues are more muscular. There are legit reasons for wanting opposite sex in that case.
I agree with HornyHubby’s assessment: the sin lies in our motives & feelings.
As for “getting busy” in public…Drew and I sometimes have our hands on each other’s rear ends, and I know others see it. It’s not ever a situation where we’re groping each other but more of a hand resting on the other’s bottom. We also have been known to discreetly engage in sexual play when others are around, the most recent example being me going commando (mostly – I just couldn’t go without some sort of bra to keep my “girls” corralled) at his work Christmas party. We’re never overt about it. Most often, it takes the form of looks and expressions between us. At the same time, I think those who know us know that we have the hots for each other. And that is okay.. Sometimes, I just look at him and get all twitterpated, and can’t hide it. All of this translates to wonderful passion in the bedroom, which is as it should be. 🙂
God Bless!
Holly
First, as a fairly new visitor here, I want to thank you for raising this question, an important one for Christians to consider and discuss . This site is such an incredible place, as few other places can men and women discuss such questions, in detail yet with discretion and anonymity respected, in an unashamed way and get respectful, serious, yet varying answers. This question itself goes to the heart of the “Everything is permissible, but not everything is constructive” balance, and I think it’s worthy to explore.
Second, I fully support the “Song of Solomon Sex” spirit of this site, so I lean towards the “permissive” as I generally think the further we go towards that end (within the context of marriage), the better marriages will be. That is, embracing a culture which itself embraces healthy marital sexuality — and that in itself is a question, how do we embrace it?
With that in mind, here are my thoughts:
The Song of Solomon is, in itself, “public”. One who understands the context of that scripture knows it is basically the first erotic story. It is public by being in the Bible, for all to imagine what the the couple is doing – having sex.
Furthermore, even within the Song of Solomon itself, there is a degree of “public sex”. Friends, indeed, are watching a beautiful married couple embrace their marriage sexually in a healthy and full-fledged way, and in my own reading of Song of Songs, it seems to me that some of the acts involving the couple may actually be in view of their friends. They, at the very least, know exactly what is going on and to me, there’s not much difference between that and the “dressing room” or “parked car” scenarios described in various places on this wonderful site.
Bringing it back to this site, this site is, though it’s the written word, also public sex. It may be read and not seen, but it’s still public, even if some of the stories are fiction — and especially those that aren’t. While I know it’s anonymous and discreet, anyone could access it. The words expressed here are explicit, and to me generate what I like to call “positive lust” (I’ll explain that in a minute), which would be the same reaction might be if they were to witness a married couple having sex.
So, if one is to embrace the kinds of things discussed here – whether fiction or real – to me then I’m going to apply the same concept to actual public sex as long as the specific circumstances in which it occurs are reasonable and appropriate.
To address a couple very valid concerns:
– Breaking the law. Out of all the objections, to me that is the most valid as purposeful breaking of the law shouldn’t be encouraged, really, and if I were to apply that literally, it would be hard to make an end run around it – but i’m going to try.
Obviously, any kind of “blatant” public sex needs to be frowned upon. If
your’e at some public pool, that’s a no no. If you’re in a hotel lobby, that’s a no no too. if you’re in the children’s department at Macy’s, don’t do it in that dressing room. If you’re at the next showing of some G movie, that would also be out. It’s just not appropriate at all.
However, in the cases typically discussed here – an adult section of a department store’s dressing room, in the woods somewhere (particularly in your own tent), at a movie where NO one else is there, in a hot tub with no one around (as long as you’re on high alert), in a parked car somewhere where there aren’t eyes-who-shouldn’t-see-it around, then it’s really perfectly fine with me.
Now, some might say that both are against the law. But so is going 76 in a 75 mph zone. But I think we’d all agree 76 is different from 95 mph in risk and in consequence. The former is a technical violation and the latter is a major violation that can land you in jail, deservedly so, because it puts others at risk. I’d say, in the cases above, “blatant” public sex is like going 95. However, the,”could be caught, but it’s unlikely and if you are it’s likely not by someone who would do more than shoo you away or not even stop you” cases are more like going 76. Furthermore, I’m not even sure they should even be technically illegal.
So, my basic answer is — it’s fine, but always be on high alert in the more risky of the situations (like a hot tub in a hotel), and just be aware that yes, someone may catch you and be ready for the embarrassment. But, stay away from anything that would, to put a fine point on it, be terribly risky and perhaps even crazy.
– It’s a sin to see others naked. I concur with others here who disagree with this view. To me, it’s not any more a sin than a man seeing a beautiful woman at the beach in a revealing swimsuit, when the only difference between near nudity and nudity is a couple pieces of fabric. Our bodies are beautiful, and while we should always be mindful of class and dignity, I don’t consider simply viewing them and appreciating them “sinful”…watching a bikini competition is not sinful. The SI Swimsuit issue isn’t sinful either. It’s beauty on display.
– The bigger question to me, is “Is it a sin to see a married couple and know they’re having sex?”, which i think is more of the question here. On this, I again would say no. if it’s a sin to say, find a couple in the woods and know that’s what they’re up to, then this site is a sin because we’re all writing or reading vivid descriptions about married sex, knowing fully what they’re up to, and I’d say the stories here do more for an image in one’s mind than even catching someone having sex, say, in the woods or in the car. If there is a line between the two, it’s an extremely thin one.
I’ll even go a step further and say that I’d say catching someone in the act in a public situation and then “thinking about it”, as well as the mental images that stem from this site’s amazing stories, both fall under the definition of
“positive lust”, which I mentioned above.
Positive lust is what I define as the natural and healthy sexual feelings may experience after witnessing or reading about (and then thinking about) a married couple having sex…one can even more broadly and define it as something that triggers lust that causes you to dream about married sex.
I think we should encourage and certainly not shun positive lust, because arousal happens and we don’t want people fearing that – as that’s a big reason for the problems our culture is in. So, if that means that we don’t shy away from stories on this site and it also means we should not fear embracing healthy sexuality in situations where *might* get caught, and most likely by an adult.
Here’s the way I look at it:
– In the case of “76 mph” public sex, the worst that can happen is someone gets a glimpse of a married couple having sex in a near private (but potentially seen) situation, and I don’t think the negative ramifications of that add up to much. Sex itself is not a sin. People do it all the time, and it’s married sex is something we should celebrate (as this site does) and not get too deeply worried about if someone happens to catch someone in the act. In fact, the positives might be that “wow, I’d like my marriage to be like that” or simply think more positively about great marital sex.
– If I were at a department store and heard a couple having sex in the next dressing room, why is that any different from, say a couple having sex in the next hotel room and being heard? I’d not say a word of complaint. In fact, it would be a sign of a healthy relationship. If I saw a couple deep in the forest on a tree stump, and they noticed me, I’d say, “Don’t mind me” and move on down the path and smile at their amazing marriage. I think it’s healthy and I’d lean towards encouraging this line of thought.
– To me, it’s all about being discreet in said situations, much like I said in the 76 mph comparison Do it in the forest, not at the path by the parking lot. Do it in the lingerie department’s dressing room. Do it an an NC-17/R movie only a couple folks are at, not in a full movie. I once heard about a couple getting permission from a hotel manager to use the hot tub after hours, and she gave a nod and said “if someone complains, it’s on you.” That’s discretion. So, I say, go for it but use both your heads when approaching the situation!
– Finally, in some ways, though we always must be mindful of not causing our “brother to stumble” (a passage I take quite seriously), we can’t manage how every “viewer/hearer” might react, whether that a story on this site of a couple having sex or actually seeing a couple have sex in the woods. Yes, there is a chance they might stumble, but the balance is solidly in favor of a positive outcome. In the case of a public sex incident, any “viewing” would likely be brief and while “hearing” (in the case of a hotel room) might be longer, there is really no avoiding that for anyone who lives in an apartment or is sleeping in a hotel.
So, those are my thoughts in regards to the specific questions. I do want to add a couple more thoughts on the overall topic, which I’ve actually pondered quite a bit in regards to “right/wrong”, and it applies to this topic overall:
1. In the spirit of the “friends” of Song of Songs, I want to move away from say, a “forest/pool/dressing room” question, where anyone might hear/see to a more limited situation. Say, for instance, three couples go away on a “Song of Songs” retreat to a B&B that includes discussions about sexuality (marriage retreats are not uncommon), and one night, one of the three couples is making love on a couch outside in the hallway. Let’s say one of the other couples sees this. Is this a sin? I’d say absolutely not.
2. We all support this site’s mission in favor of Married Erotica, which includes very vivid descriptions of marital sexuality in a variety of scenes which naturally cause vivid images to come into one’s mind, providing a wonderful window into a fantastic marriage in the sexual realm.. I consider this a great thing, by the way, which is healthy, even if cutting edge. To further that point, let’s say a “Song of Solomon-embracing” married couple was having a party with other “Song of Solomon” married couples, and had sex in the backroom while they were still there, in earshot. Would this be a sin or inappropriate? What if the door was open? Some would say yes and I think they have a point. However, to me there is not a huge amount of distance between that and what we do here — and I’d say the “friends” in that situation wouldn’t be much different than the “friends” in the SOS. For what it’s worth, I could go either way on this question.
Anyway, I’ve typed way too long on this thread but the question you raise is a great one, and I hope my analysis of the matter is helpful and interesting to some.
God bless everyone here!
I love these discussions. I have often had to ponder these questions by myself until i discovered this site and I’m glad so many other people are living in the freedom that I am.
I’d be intrested in hearing the biblical evidence that seeing sombody naked is a sin.
Other thoughts on the comments I’ve read:
Everything is permissible but not everything is beneficial. Where are we gonna draw the the line on this one? Surly hate, murder, rape, etc is not permissible so whats the context here? I know it applies to meat sacrified to idols. Can we apply it to semi public married sex? I dont know but I wouldn’t feel convicted unless I was trying to be seen.
Is it a sin to see other people having sex? I wouldn’t feel convicted of it unless I was trying to see them, or continued to watch them after I did see them. And would it be ok to watch because they are married? I think not, how could you even tell unless you were close enough to see their rings? Would you be looking at their hands?
I really like the idea of having enough sexual freedom under grace to have no rules and be able to see and be seen by others and be able to take my wife in the kmart parking lot, but in my mind thats inviting other people into the marriage bed which is where i draw my moral line.
I think the stories and some of the comments on this website also come dangerously close to that line too, but at the same time I read about people being turned on to monogomy and married Christian sex by this site, as well as people helping each other and discussing their sex problems.
Another thing I’ve noticed about myself on this site is I consume it rapidly like porn so I have to make sure I dont let this become an idol for me.
Regarding nudity, I believe that although there is no endorsement of public nudity in the Bible, neither is there a prohibition, as evidenced by the following:
– Isaiah was called by God to go nude for an extended period of time – and God never commands us to sin. So, being naked in public is, therefore, in and of itself not a sin.
– Saul stripped and prophesied naked – the Bible passage indicates that is what prophets did, so his doing it led observers (i.e it was public) to question whether he was a prophet.
– Peter fished naked – with no condemnation
– a young man in the garden fled naked when his robe was grabbed- indicating that he did not have underwear, and again with no condemnation
I have been nude in front of doctors (my female dermatologist, for routine skin exams), nurses (at my urologist), and this is commonly accepted in American Christian circles. My wife is an RN and totally unfazed by nudity in a medical setting. There has been NO sexual thought or action at all.
My wife and I have been nude countless times at hot springs, resorts, beaches, hiking, etc. with no sexual activity or lustful thoughts. Many people don't believe that non-sexual nudity is possible. It is possible and the norm at the places we've visited.